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00:00.26
wildremedies
Welcome to the wild remedies again for round 2 Rob and Gary the journeyman so thrilled to be chatting with you guys today. How are you.

00:02.91
Robert _ Gary
Wonderful exactly to be here.

00:10.48
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, when pining for you since Gary's birthday

00:15.39
wildremedies
Yay! It's been like so long since we talked I think it's been like what three days or something. Yeah, we just her note on the weekend Harry's birthday yeah amazing well I'm really looking forward to this conversation. It's something that I have been sitting with for a little bit and you know broach the subject with you guys around kind of ethics in psychedelics and. I know that there's some things that you guys have been seeing happening out in the psychedelic world that has resulted in a little bit of dysfunction which you're trying to patch up a little bit. Um I recently had a psychedelic experience where I left. Feeling not so great and reached out to you guys and you're like oh okay, it's probably because of this and so essentially what I'd love to do is just have a conversation about what's kind of happening like I feel that in the west here. There's been such a huge explosion. Of use of psychedelics and everybody wants to use this medicine to heal or maybe avoid substances or we hear that there's clinical trials being used for curing depression. All of these things and because we are so dysfunctional and so dysregulated in western society.

01:46.88
wildremedies
We're kind of like glomming onto this but from a very ungrounded space and it's creating some consequences and what that looks like is.

01:48.85
Robert _ Gary
Um, within.

01:59.78
wildremedies
A lot of people. You know there's people who are doing Journeys in basements maybe by themselves or with groups of people and coming out of the experience quote unquote like a little bit fucked up right? Um, so I'm just wondering what what you guys have been kind of seeing.

02:05.87
Robert _ Gary
Ah, have.

02:18.34
Robert _ Gary
Definitely yeah, we've been hearing a lot of stories from other people who have been in other Journeys and I think that the big question is pulling everything back to what is the purpose of.

02:19.75
wildremedies
Out there and like if that's something that we kind of need to be concerned about.

02:32.84
Robert _ Gary
You as an individual embarking on the journey. What is it that you want to learn what is it that you want to understand about yourself and what is it that you actually want to create on the other side and I think that's the biggest piece that. People are most likely missing that they think oh, it's just about the actual journey and I'm going to go and I'm going to do this every weekend for the next fifty two weeks and it's there's a big question I think about the soulful integrity. Of who who's facilitating what is what is the depth of their knowledge of the medicine space but also energetic space and what is what have they moved through as an individual. And what kind of space are they creating for you because we're hearing stories and I won't get into the specifics. But for the most part. It's just a lack of integrity of like when someone comes into a journey with us. We know. That you're putting yourself in a very vulnerable state in a lot of levels for the most part. It's a spiritual mental emotional and the physical and if the facilitator isn't going to.

03:58.14
Robert _ Gary
Have the highest degree of respect and integrity and intent for that individual then I would run and I would find another facilitator and just to paint a picture in in your mind of like when people come and journey with us. It's literally.

04:11.96
wildremedies
And.

04:17.20
Robert _ Gary
You're in silence. You're in stillness. We're guiding you from the inside and you're most likely in stillness for a good 5 hours ish and there's a lot of support. There's preparation support. We get to know you. It's not in this world of. Coming back every weekend. So if that's happening to you if you're listening to this and if you're being invited back into the journey I would actually question the person who's inviting you back in every weekend because again.

04:46.24
wildremedies
Um.

04:53.82
Robert _ Gary
Dialing it back to what is the purpose of you actually taking that journey on and what is the intent. What is the intent of the facilitator as Well. What is the intent of the guide because it's meant for you to in our experience. It's meant for for you as an individual. To have pieces puzzle pieces that you haven't quite embodied and those puzzle pieces are given to you during the journey and you're to take them with reverence and you're to take those energetic puzzle pieces. It's information that's presented to you So when the guide can actually have that spiritual vision and can see that with you to some extent.. There's a common spiritual vision of what's being experienced and there must be a high level of. Respect for the individual's Journey. Yeah.

06:02.66
wildremedies
Um, yeah, yeah for sure man Yeah because I feel like what's happening and I've I've been hearing about this. Quite often and it's not necessarily even happening in groups but people are kind of dosing themselves as well and not being able to integrate. They don't have the support right? like and not even necessarily with like I know you guys work with Psilocybin predominantly. But.

06:15.40
Robert _ Gary
Um, yes I want.

06:30.91
wildremedies
I know this story of this guy that I had met a few years ago and I don't know how he got his hands on iboga but he decided to journey on his own with iboga and ended up with pretty severe tinnitus afterwards and.

06:34.62
Robert _ Gary
Um.

06:48.41
wildremedies
Then just went down this huge rabbit hole of like depression and freaking out and you know I remember he had like all of these computer programs and he was like hooking his head up to like these things where he was trying to analyze his brain waves and like it just like it went into like.

06:58.43
Robert _ Gary
Answer me.

07:06.74
wildremedies
Ah, very dark place for him and it felt really bad. But like if you're not prepared like I think you also have to be in a space where you're prepared for something like this too I was listening to another podcast recently and I would love to have this person come on because he had a very similar iboga experience where he. Had ear ringing and some issues afterwards and ended up on like a whole psychotherapy route afterwards and what he kind of came to the conclusion was was like psychedelics aren't for everyone right? like what is your. What is your outlook on the world before you step into doing psychedelics like is it really negative. Do you see the world from a negative lens. Do you see the world from like a beautiful positive lens because the medicine and the spirit is going to show you what's already in your psyche and I think. Also what I'm seeing right now is sort of a champion or championing of the hero dose right? because like we've heard so many stories from like. Gabamate and like Paul Stamitz and stuff and they talk about like these really cool crazy experiences that they've had where they've done like friggin twenty six grams of mushrooms or something and.

08:25.99
wildremedies
Yeah, these stories are really fascinating because they're just like um like I saw God and it was so amazing and I had all these downloads and epiphanies and things like that. Um, but. These are people that have been working with the medicine for a really long time and probably have a certain relationship with it and so I think just like jump into it and take a hero dose or be given a hero dose can do more more harm than good. Yeah, is that is that something like I'm wondering what experiences like have you guys had people come to you being like hey I'm damaged now please help me like.

09:00.36
Robert _ Gary
Ah, the benight ah slightly knocked off center by their experience and they just need um guides or assistance to get back in alignment um with themselves. It's nothing to brag about.

09:11.40
wildremedies
Okay, listen.

09:19.63
Robert _ Gary
If you're bragging with your friends because you're doing five grams 6 7 eight grams like it's your first go at it. You know the medicine if you don't respect it honestly, it's going to kick you in the ass and this is what we hear a lot of people get kicked in the butt.

09:22.69
wildremedies
And then.

09:34.37
Robert _ Gary
You know they don't understand why? well they didn't understand the process that they were putting themselves through going on a five six gram journey um you can see god on two grams I mean you probably could see god without the mushrooms. Totally honestly, but. But that's not the end. All be all to see god there's a lot more It's unpacking is what you want to do and if you're unable to unpack what you see or has's been presented to you and you get caught in those loops. There's no way out if there's nobody there to assist you. You're stuck in it for like four or five hours

09:57.54
wildremedies
Um, and.

10:12.28
Robert _ Gary
And that's when you hear quote the bad trip. The bad experience this what? ah you hear people's testimonials about how it was a bad journey and so that puts fright into the general public who want to go on a journey. But are afraid because you hear all these stories of people bragging. You know there sure is a bragging or is it warning I'm not too sure I'm confused there is are you bragging? Are you warning me about what's going on. So it's as Rob said um in anything like a plant medicine. Do your investigation. And don't just check a box online. This is the journey that you want to do a 4 day retreat because it's no retreating you're not retreating anywhere you're going to do work and that's what the medicine is about it's here to teach you and for you to learn more about yourself and what the world has to offer. Yeah. It's not the brownie badge thing is like the girl guide thing you don't wear a sashs like I got the cooking badge and I I got I got the aaas guy I got theselocybin a guy ah boga got whatever the 5 grand the 10 ground. Yeah, totally it's it's like listen listen to your body be and tunemb with yourself and not what somebody else is trying to tell you to do.

11:09.95
wildremedies
In.

11:24.79
Robert _ Gary
We don't tell anybody what to do we guide and suggest but it comes down to you making the final decision. Especially if you're coming on our journey with us. We don't say you have to take 3 or 4 or 5 or six grams we listen we hear what you where you're at and what you feel comfortable doing.

11:26.29
wildremedies
Um, again.

11:42.78
Robert _ Gary
We find that you're only going to do it like a small dose we you know talk about that and then say well if you're here to do the work at least 2.5 is a good sort of beginner start from our experience. Somebody else can say something different and then you can add to it as always says you can't take it away once it's in your system. And that's the thing you got to write out if you took 5 brams and you're in it. You got to be in it for the whole run. Um, and I think we can even dial that back too as well with respect to the medicine. It's the energy the medicine regardless of dosage like.

12:02.76
wildremedies
Um.

12:11.92
wildremedies
In in.

12:21.60
Robert _ Gary
It can be you can I know people that have had potent Journeys on Microdoses So like when the student is ready the teacher of the medicine will appear and so ah, yeah, it's dosage.

12:34.26
wildremedies
In.

12:40.20
Robert _ Gary
And the whole ego aspect of like oh I did this or did that it's's I think it's completely. That's just part of the ego saying like Yay look what I did and yeah, so it's there are so many different pieces that we evaluate.

12:43.63
wildremedies
Me.

12:57.38
wildremedies
E.

12:58.15
Robert _ Gary
That whole entire process and again it's not like we take time to get to know our clients. So it's it's not just high come for the weekend. Um, it's getting to know our people on the spiritual and mental the emotional and the physical levels and what is their history What it like.

13:05.37
wildremedies
And.

13:15.43
Robert _ Gary
What is their their mental health history. What has their journey been. What's taking place in their childhood. We look at all of those pieces so because we are 100% certain that we have no idea what you're going to encounter in a journey. However, we are 100% certain that we can. Care for you in that vulnerable state at a very very high level with a high degree of respect and integrity for your journey so that you come through to the other side with context and understanding so that when you leave. You actually you actually have work to do and most of our people say like yeah I probably won't be back for like 2 to 3 like I've got a lot of work to do and um so it's it's not just in the world of like weekend after weekend.

13:55.81
wildremedies
It.

14:12.16
Robert _ Gary
Ah, it's I was even thinking about this before this podcast like would you go on a personal development course every single weekend and take the same course over and over again, probably not, you need time the human being the human beings that we are today.

14:27.44
wildremedies
A b.

14:28.37
Robert _ Gary
We need time to integrate because there are things that people see in Journeys that they have never ever experienced before in this lifetime or they've never they haven't remembered into it and so there's a deep level of remembering that hey I'm I'm not just this meetsu that's sitting here before you. There's there's ah, a multidimensional context that can really like open people up to something new and then it's like okay so I am an infinite multidimensional being how do I work with that now. So it's giving people the tools to continue that work and. I believe after 1 journey it can take years to integrate it. So we jokingly say that ah our work is all about the the new Ai which is applied integration.

15:26.98
wildremedies
Yeah, yeah, the integration part I think is really critical and might be a little bit lacking like I remember even the iboga journey that I did several years ago

15:28.27
Robert _ Gary
A.

15:46.18
wildremedies
Like there was definitely some preparation and stuff but like and you know came to ceremony with a list of things that we wanted to work on but I there there definitely was that lack of like follow up care and and and I think it depends on the person too right.

15:59.73
Robert _ Gary
Um, and.

16:04.60
wildremedies
And there's different reasons for for wanting to journey people who are more experienced and want to explore the depths of consciousness and do those hero-type journeys and maybe have a lot of experience. That's 1 thing but a lot of people are coming in with like you know, maybe a brain injury.

16:14.14
Robert _ Gary
In it.

16:23.67
wildremedies
Or you know they're suffering really deeply with depression and things like that and being kind of blown open and having like an ego-deaf experience and then being like you know, patded on the ass and being like okay and like have have a great time and get on with your life. It's like that that can leave people really reeling. Um.

16:31.59
Robert _ Gary
And I.

16:42.50
Robert _ Gary
Think.

16:42.76
wildremedies
And just for a little bit of context the last journey that I did it like it was so great like I Absolutely love everybody that was there and you know made really great friends and like most everybody was like super dope and but it fell more of like kind of a party like experience.

16:49.93
Robert _ Gary
Experience.

17:00.36
wildremedies
Um, and there was a lot of us there and I personally at the time enjoyed my experience and it was okay but I have a lot of experience right? But I left with a few key issues. 1 of them being my. My my gut microbiome like I don't know if the high dose of medicine that I took just carpet bombed my gut but like I was feeling really low like I basically couldn't function for like two or three weeks afterwards

17:28.12
Robert _ Gary
10

17:38.16
wildremedies
And after about a week or so like I was just not feeling any better and I was starting to get like these really weird sort of spells like it just it felt like I felt really like happy and at peace I think because the the mushrooms can do that.

17:53.53
Robert _ Gary
And then.

17:57.51
wildremedies
But at the same time my energy was just it was like squash like there was something wrong and I intuitively got a hit to reach out to one of my shaman people here who does reiki and energy work and she psychic and stuff and I was like it was just like talk to Jordan you need to talk to Jordan so I reached out to Jordan. Was like hey girl I need a session. She's like okay okay and it took me about four days to get in to see her and I was so whacked out I almost crashed my car on driving to go see her like I was out of it and I show up and walk in and she was like whoa like what.

18:17.58
Robert _ Gary
In.

18:34.31
wildremedies
Is with your energy and I was like oh no, but I feel really bad and I get down on her table and she's like oh man light like you you have a bunch of energetic like entity shit hanging on to you and during the the ceremony like we all. You know we're instructed to put a bubble around us and whatever but like I don't think that that was strong enough and when you're in the medicine like you're so blown open like I had such a beautiful experience and my third eye was blown right? open it was and it was great but like. You have stuff that is just floating around. You have people's things and if you're an empathic person like I am you know stuff can just come into your your energy field and it can stick with you now if you're an individual that is not aware of those types of things that doesn't get intuitive hits to call you.

19:24.12
Robert _ Gary
And.

19:25.51
wildremedies
Your fucking shaman next door like you could be left reeling from that experiencing quite Ill for God knows how long and so that to me is concerning. And a thing that I think we just need to talk about because it's not like you just go in to the medicine you're going to have a crazy experience and have all of these epiphanies and you're going to feel great and whatever like there. There's a lot. So I think it's really important to ask some questions about how these Journeys are facilitated for people.

19:47.79
Robert _ Gary
The.

19:58.58
wildremedies
I mean like we talked about this over the weekend but like you guys don't host any like the largest ceremony. You guys have done has been with like 6 people or something right? Okay, yeah, yeah and I mean and when you look at.

19:58.82
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, yes, and typically it's 4 It's 4 less? Yeah yeah.

20:18.60
wildremedies
Indigenous cultures where the shaman is performing the ceremony like generally they can see energy so they're going around and they can see stuff and they can move things and they can.

20:30.62
Robert _ Gary
Um, aha.

20:31.77
wildremedies
Transmute and they see you're sitting with something heavy and like they can literally physically move that stuff for you and I think that is such a key Huge important part of the process because you can end up taking on some shit.

20:38.42
Robert _ Gary
Yeah I think there's 4 words that are like really yelling loud at me right now and the first one is energetic integrity and the second pair of words is spiritual vision. So. Does the individual that you're working with have spiritual vision. Can they actually see what's going on energetically in a room and then with their high level of attunement can they actually work with the energy in the room when we are in ceremony. It is.

21:08.17
wildremedies
And.

21:14.56
Robert _ Gary
Constant We are maintaining the energetic integrity of this space nonstop and we use a multitude of different energetic spiritual technologies that we have been gifted to maintain that space and there are. Firm Firm boundaries put in place whereby yes you can tell someone to put out their bubble. However, when you're in an actual journey the Medicine man or medicine woman that is is tending to you has to be able to.

21:37.38
wildremedies
He.

21:51.34
Robert _ Gary
Care for you in a deeply deeply deeply nourishing way and they have to have that capacity to stick with you when that individual who's in the journey is going through the trenches. Because we've seen it whereby people like and whatever they can deal with their own Stuff. There's like no, you need to be on the metaphysical energetic planes with that individual side by Side. There's a soulful collaboration that takes place and if we look at yesteryear.

22:13.90
wildremedies
Is.

22:26.26
wildremedies
Head.

22:27.49
Robert _ Gary
When people lived in tribes. What happened people didn't go on journeys every freaking weekend if that's happening to you ask yourself some questions again like Journeys are meant to be initiations from 1 phase of life to another. You're not going into a new phase of life every week so there is no way that you can integrate all of that information if you're doing it every week and it and we've spoken to some people and it's like they you can become highly fragmented and so.

22:54.38
wildremedies
It.

23:04.52
Robert _ Gary
That whole piece of like energetic integrity is so huge and because I even remember remember when you messaged me as well and I was like oh it's like I need to do a clearing and and we did that and that was like a I. Ah, piece of the puzzle that we were guided to hey let's have a conversation about this and so yeah, again, it's all back to Integrity. So and like we're kind of in a little bit of the the wild West right now.

23:36.32
wildremedies
Me here.

23:44.44
Robert _ Gary
Psychedelics and the Western world is like a little bit psychedelic happy. But if we look to yesteryear when people live in those tribes the other piece of that puzzle is that everyone knew.

23:49.36
wildremedies
E.

23:57.91
Robert _ Gary
Everyone in the village. Everyone in the tribe knew that this one person or 2 people were going on a journey and as a result the whole entire village the whole entire tribe was there to support them afterwards and if you're going back into your 9 to 5 job after a weekend journey. Most people. Aren't going to even recognize that you did they may sense a difference in you and may ask you but that tribe that support afterwards is so vitally important and like we have people that we worked with like six years ago and we still support people in that whole entire process of remembering into those deeply transcendental touchstone moments and weaving them through into your current reality because that's what was presented to you so when you have someone with that spiritual that high level of spiritual vision. Ah, high level of soulful energetic integrity like that's that's a game changer that I think is needed in western medicine space.

25:08.30
wildremedies
Yeah, yeah, I completely agree like 1 thing that I've been kind of struggling with is just seeing how the west is adopting plant medicine.

25:18.68
Robert _ Gary
And.

25:25.49
wildremedies
And transforming it into something more pharmaceutical and it's like it's it's weighing on me like it. It hurts my heart to see that and I can I can understand why right? you know people are experimenting and they're trying things and. You know they're mixing psilocybin with Mdma and throwing some ketamine and stuff in there and there's a more clinical setting you know because people are afraid of you know the shamanistic aspect of all of these things and something like something about it to me energetically just feels like that's just not. I don't know if that's the way like I think it's really cool to explore some of these things but when we're working specifically with plant medicine like and I said this just on the podcast recording that I did yesterday but the more that we move away from nature. The more dysfunction is created.

26:17.81
Robert _ Gary
Smith A.

26:19.86
wildremedies
Right? So when we're blending all of these chemicals and stuff with what is already potent plant wisdom and knowledge like why? Why are we fucking with it seriously.

26:25.57
Robert _ Gary
Ah, well, that's what I broke down is don't fuck with mother nature. It's pure as it is you know, learn how to work with it in its natural form. Do not try to extract something out of it for pharmaceutical use.

26:39.48
wildremedies
Yeah.

26:41.59
Robert _ Gary
That's not really going through the spiritual growth that is required from the the mushroom itself. That's what it's about. It's not trying to fix or cure anything. It's trying to assist you on your path moving forward in your life so you make conscious choices.

26:53.77
wildremedies
E.

26:59.23
Robert _ Gary
You learn about your past and you learn how to let go Medicine is going to assist you in its purest form I can't compare it to a clinical form because I haven't been through it but the purity is being tainted with.

27:09.37
wildremedies
In. Yeah.

27:17.37
Robert _ Gary
And the clinical or a Clinicnician whoever is there I don't know who they are but do they have that hands-on Inner guidance to assist you other than sitting there with her Notepad or giving you a glass of water and putting your hand on the shoulder you know is that's not the journey.

27:24.50
wildremedies
And yeah, um.

27:37.33
Robert _ Gary
That's not the journey. Yeah, there has to be a way to move forward using it in its purest form in a clinical setting that's going to keep the the purpose of the medicine moving forward. It has to there has to be a way and other than.

27:45.38
wildremedies
Um.

27:56.66
Robert _ Gary
You know us doing what we're doing. We don't work with everybody as you know we go through an interviewing process and then if somebody who needs clinical assistance. You know there is a number of places out there to go that we can't work with or we're not capable of working with extreme Psd. Pdsd pdsd. Yeah yeah, yeah, and I think the the big part in that too is that western society has been so deeply addicted to consumption and there has to be a transition to creation.

28:24.56
wildremedies
He did.

28:32.54
Robert _ Gary
As opposed to just consuming consuming consuming so consuming a journey every weekend. Um or every even every month ah there has to be some aspect of recognizing that you are a spiritual being and if someone is trying to take the magic out of the mushroom so that it's just a. A biochemical reaction. That's not what the medicines here for the medicine is here so that you freaking learn from it you as an individual learn something from it so that you can elevate yourself to ah another version of who you are the old 1 dies away. And you're learning. You're growing. That's like the modus operandi of all of humanity is to grow and to create so creator has given us medicines so that we can learn from it and create from it if there's no creation between your journeys. Then I'd say there's ah a yellow if not a red flag on the play I just had a vision if you take the mushroom and you make it clinical and you take whatever you need out of it to assist somebody I see mother guy out on the other side and a window. Great.

29:39.35
wildremedies
You.

29:45.84
Robert _ Gary
Supposed be in there with you I'm on the other side. What have you done you tainted it I'm here I'd supposed to help you and she's still knocking on the window is like who's locked me out. Ah.

30:01.10
wildremedies
Um, f.

30:02.25
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, as that is.

30:08.82
wildremedies
Oh goodness well and it's like that with everything right? Yeah I know it's funny. Um, just in in my plant communication journey right now I'm working strictly with dandelion for this entire summer I'm choosing.

30:15.30
Robert _ Gary
Um, family.

30:24.86
Robert _ Gary
Um, and.

30:25.26
wildremedies
1 plant I was guided to just pick one because I'm going off and I'm trying all these different things and my guides have been like 1 Shes one and it's very like that that that spear is very similar right? Where like you have we have all of these little flags.

30:43.70
Robert _ Gary
Then.

30:45.90
wildremedies
On in our yards, right? being like I'm right here I'm right here like work with me I can help you and yet we're the way that we just ignore. The magic and the beauty and the spirit of nature and in ego try to turn it into something else or think that we know better is exactly what's creating all of the chaos in our world right now and to come back into balance.

31:02.57
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, then. So.

31:18.25
Robert _ Gary
Um, within.

31:19.86
wildremedies
We need to embrace the wisdom but we need guides right? and so I love what you said about needing to have an experience that facilitated with someone that has vision and I know you guys are looking at training.

31:32.47
Robert _ Gary
Um.

31:38.58
wildremedies
More guides which I love I see that being such an important thing moving forward because I know for me moving like for for for future journeys that's gonna be a necessity for me. Um, can't. Like what when you're training people like are you helping to open Thirdeye like are you able to facilitate that sort of thing or do the people coming to you already need to have those gifts.

31:57.86
Robert _ Gary
Um I think it's a it can be either or and we're like we're just in the infancy of of creating that ah those programs and we would want to look at like.

32:13.49
Robert _ Gary
Not their whole entire resume. But what have you grown through where where have you been? What have you been doing? What have you been working on um and like I've seen people like open up pretty quickly and have ah like what I would call a quickening experience whereby they they have that spiritual vision.

32:16.45
wildremedies
Um.

32:32.49
Robert _ Gary
So um, yeah, like we would want to know like are you able to see on the inside are you able to like pick up on things are you able to trust your intuition are you able to like 1 of the things that is and will be part of the program is that. It's not prescriptive. It's not oh this is what the dreaming collective do and you have to do it this way. It's opening up to your gifts with again with that high level of integrity high level of intent for the individual or individuals that are with you and really trusting those gifts that can come online for you.

33:04.32
wildremedies
And.

33:06.53
Robert _ Gary
And um, yeah, because there are pieces of the puzzle that we've created that no human has ever taught us but we've been gifted with a number of different things that we use in our journey to maintain the integrity of the space and to and to also to. Help people move through those loops and it's um, yeah, it's vitally important to know who you're with and then for us in that program. It's also. Like can you actually sit and be with someone on the inside when they're really going through the depths of their own darkness or when they've they've actually discovered their light or their genius and can you help them translate it.

33:57.91
wildremedies
Um, hidden it.

34:03.83
Robert _ Gary
And can you help them give context to what they've discovered and distill it and percolate it into their life or their business. Ah I find that the most important thing if you're coming into a facilitator or if you're whatever you're doing with the medicine is can you put your shit on the shelf. And leave it there and get it and step aside to be the vessel the conduit of information that's going to flow through you for them. So Basically then you deal with your stuff afterwards. So It's learning how to just put it away.

34:31.26
wildremedies
Um.

34:37.78
Robert _ Gary
Get out of the way so you can be there fully for your clients. Yeah.

34:46.90
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, yeah.

34:48.88
wildremedies
Yeah, yeah, and I think that takes a certain type of person right? to you know, have that type of wanting to help that loving connection and it just has to be part of the personality.

34:55.55
Robert _ Gary
Um, yeah I.

34:58.48
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, the room.

35:08.70
wildremedies
Too right? like and it's not for everybody and that's okay, right I think there's that's a different ways to support this you know space and this new frontier. That's that's being built that I think is really important and very potent. You know with all the dysfunction that we are currently in like.

35:11.49
Robert _ Gary
Um, with um death. Yeah.

35:25.44
wildremedies
We do need these experiences but you know and and it's fine. We're going to bump up against some some things as we find our way. 1 thing that I a thing that I heard recently that I thought was really enlightening was.

35:25.66
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, yeah.

35:43.38
wildremedies
Someone was explaining how it's almost unfair to expect so in indigenous cultures. You know we have a lot of people that are going down to South South american things and are looking to shamans. Support and wanting to have these experiences in a more traditional way and I know that there's you know a bit of lack of integrity that's happening there now because it's become almost like a tourist type thing unfortunately, um, but it's important for us. To figure out our way through those experiences because the people who have all of these western folks coming down like these these are indigenous people that have grown up in nature that are from a completely different culture. And then we have our crazy asses with all of our neuroses and our fucked up societal stuff going down there and being like being completely disregulated and being like help me help me help me help me cure me cure me cure me cure me and there's only so much that they can hold in that too right.

36:42.42
Robert _ Gary
Are you.

36:54.59
wildremedies
Like the level of understanding that they're going to have of like there are some cultures that don't even have a word for for anxiety. They don't even know what that word is and we wake up with it every day most a lot of us you know and.

36:57.91
Robert _ Gary
Name.

37:13.56
wildremedies
So yeah, we're at this really interesting pinnacle this frontier where it's like okay we see that there is power here and healing and potential and we just we need to bump up ah around a few things and figure out how to make it work for us.

37:14.24
Robert _ Gary
Um.

37:32.97
wildremedies
And a way that is going to be healing in a way that is going to be grounded in a way that is going to connect us to mother nature and rather than taking and taking what can I get from this. What can I get from this what more messages what more downloads What? what can I take take take take take kind of switch that focus.

37:39.88
Robert _ Gary
Ah.

37:48.91
Robert _ Gary
You can.

37:50.95
wildremedies
And have a more integrated experience that puts you on a new path. Another thing that I keep thinking is like the energetics of mushrooms like they're they're decomposers they decompose. They take things apart.

37:53.95
Robert _ Gary
Yeah.

38:08.54
Robert _ Gary
And.

38:09.51
wildremedies
And I'm kind of curious I'm wondering what your thoughts are on microdosing right? There's a lot of people that are microdosing every single day and I have a teacher that had some strong things to say about that he said we're overdosing on mushrooms like as decomposers like we don't need to be consuming this.

38:19.77
Robert _ Gary
Has.

38:28.37
wildremedies
All the time and apology anybody listening who's like entire business might revolve around mushrooms I know we have some mushrooms in our products. Although the one teacher that I spoke to he he kind of thinks that chalk is more of a lichen than a mushroom which I was like oh okay, that's that's an interesting observation.

38:31.48
Robert _ Gary
Right.

38:41.27
Robert _ Gary
I Think the primary thing is what is your intent. What is your purpose If you're again, if you're taking that to get something from it without again integrating. Ah.

38:45.93
wildremedies
Um, but yeah, what? what would you guys think about that.

38:52.19
wildremedies
Then.

38:57.88
Robert _ Gary
Ask yourself some questions about that and I don't think it's something that you need to take every day. Um, it's not a supplement. It's not like your vitamins is you have a handful of vitamins and you put glass of water and there you go there. You start your day. It's um, it's.

38:59.00
wildremedies
30 in.

39:13.70
Robert _ Gary
Your intent behind it definitely for sure is like if you take it without intention. You don't know sure it's small doses but it still has potency that's going to alter your being of who you are energetically and you just you know. I not against it and we've done microdosing a bit and but it's not We're not called to do it every day. It's not prescriptive. Yeah I think that like we have a whole entire apothecary of so many different supplements and a lot of people were like oh you have to take this every day. It's like no like if we like. Circling back to the whole like nature piece if we actually connect to the fact that we are freaking nature this this meat suit this human suit that we're in it is nature. We don't need to go outside to connect to nature and if we really start listening to that innate intelligence that we all have. And and stop using the monkey mind of like oh yeah, I'm going to do this every day for the next ninety days it's like well what happens if you get to day 10 and and you actually feel like you don't need it anymore then listen to that and stop just getting on the bandwagon of it of a trend and listen to yourself deeply and.

40:25.72
wildremedies
A.

40:27.69
Robert _ Gary
Like you said the mushroom is a decomposer it decomposes that which is no longer necessary in in forests and if you're taking it. It's going to be decomposing different aspects of of your being and sending that nutrients out into the forest into the human being. To create something New. So again I would ask what are you creating from it. You have there. There is an aspect that if you keep taking it then you're going to almost compound like if it's if it's for anxiety you're going to compound it whereby. It's like I have all this creation Energy. That's been.

40:57.74
wildremedies
In.

41:05.64
Robert _ Gary
Decomposed and illuminated and there's all these ideas but I haven't done anything with them. So I need to microose more so you're in this vicious cycle of like just taper back for a while and see what after maybe a two week stint or maybe a 30 day stint just. Doing it with reverence respecting the medicine of what it's here to teach you and create from it. Don't just focus on consuming it so that you can consume something else even more and just honor it because again I think it'll it'll kick your ass. Yeah.

41:49.82
wildremedies
Um, yeah, yeah, it makes me think of like you know taking psychedelics for focus for work right? for me just feels like.

41:56.35
Robert _ Gary
A file.

42:03.65
wildremedies
Not quite in alignment right? Like maybe maybe Lion's main you know sure but like psychedelics I Just I feel there just needs to be more reverence for it right? like with with our teacher plants all plants. Let's be approached with reverence. They all have spirits all of them.

42:06.63
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, yes, they're all medicines even the lettuce even radishes they're all medicines but all teachers they're all teachers. Definitely yeah and if we can just get back to that aspect of our connection to nature.

42:22.59
wildremedies
Yeah position.

42:26.80
Robert _ Gary
Then that in itself is is a game changer and we often say Microdose equals a micro shift. So if you actually really want to shift then like maybe actually inquire about a journey and actually go in in and do the work and.

42:31.67
wildremedies
And.

42:45.25
Robert _ Gary
The other piece to that too is that I know some people are really afraid of like what's going to happen like if I go and do a microdose of like 2 or 3 or four grams and they're like am I going to lose my mind. It's like yes, you are because you're supposed to lose your mind the old version of who you are that wants to say goodbye is composed of thoughts feelings. And emotions and habitual actions and there's this like optimal version of you over here. That's calling you and if you actually let this mind this old version of you die then you can embody the new. So um, that whole aspect of just. People being fearful sometimes taking a microdose and be like oh actually like I'm okay because I even know someone who did microdose recently and she was like I'm a mom of 3 children and leave a dog and a cat a house and a husband and all of these things and.

43:25.83
wildremedies
Here.

43:42.70
Robert _ Gary
Was actually able to have one singular thought instead of 40 running through her head. So and again she she did that with a high level of intention or a high level of respect and with some trepidation of like what's going to happen. So sometimes it can be ah.

43:51.20
wildremedies
And and.

44:01.50
Robert _ Gary
The micro dosing can actually lay the groundwork. No pun intended for the the soil of your soul to actually get ready to actually go on a journey So many benefits. Definitely.

44:19.48
wildremedies
Um I Love that Okay, very cool. Yeah well and and I mean and I get the appeal of. Wanting to journey all the time I mean the last one that I did was like it was beautiful and some of the messages that I got I found It was quite interesting actually because the way that we did. The medicine was a way that hit quite hard and fast and was something that I wasn't expecting.

44:44.27
Robert _ Gary
And.

44:51.60
wildremedies
But I had a lot of remembrance and integration from my iboga experience. So it actually didn't fully feel like mushrooms to me. It felt like a blend of the iboga and the mushroom and I got a much better understanding of the personality.

44:53.36
Robert _ Gary
A.

45:03.16
Robert _ Gary
And.

45:10.67
wildremedies
Of both of those spirits because I forgot it was such a long time ago since I did iboga and iboga was so deep and dark and it shows you very twisted things like for hours and hour hour hours and hour hour hour s and hour hour hours and hours and hours on end I would just see very vividly with my eyes closed. Just. Demented tormented falling apart and changing and faces falling off and all these things and I wasn't afraid of it. But that's just that's just the personality of it right? It's very dark. It's dark and deep and it's like taken you apart on so many levels. Um.

45:30.10
Robert _ Gary
And brands.

45:38.62
Robert _ Gary
Um, and.

45:44.70
Robert _ Gary
Um.

45:47.87
wildremedies
But I've been through a lot of deep dark shit in my life and so for me I was like oh this is fascinating like okay I guess we're just riding this out for 24 hours and you know and I just found it fascinating but with the mushrooms it was. It's. Rainbows and light and just you know I remember just being in complete awe because of how deep I was brought and I was just like oh man like I didn't know it could be like this I didn't know it could be like this and the message was just lay back. We're doing stuff.

46:19.40
Robert _ Gary
Um.

46:21.76
wildremedies
Your your Dna is being reorganized right now and just let it happen and there was you know, kind of an ego death that was no one no person. No not no thing for for a while. Um and there there was a lot of beauty in it and. The the experience overall all was was wonderful. But I wish I had gone in with more intention with more um integration for sure. So yeah. And that didn't happen that long ago and I'm I'm not really interested in doing another but like unless it's with you guys. But um I feel like I was good for a bit right? Especially the rough like two or three weeks after that and I think there was also just a lot of stuff energetically going on too like. Were coming into Ac clips season and there was a bunch of like crazy new moonshot like it's just ah, ah basically in my life since that experience in March I have been in a washing machine ever since kind of like kicked it off and.

47:17.74
Robert _ Gary
Um.

47:24.11
Robert _ Gary
Um, and yeah, absolutely you It's right he did see and.

47:28.17
wildremedies
A lot of it is is just fateful things that are meant to happen right now and I know that I was meant to be there and have that experience so that we could have this conversation right? and like nobody's wrong, right? Just yeah, it's just where what we're learning and like let's put out way together to. Empower each other and to hold even more light as we travel through you know this new portal that we're all going through right now.

47:50.28
Robert _ Gary
Totally yeah yeah yeah I think that's the the big thing with all of that. It's like is ah I would say it's like a communal elevation that we can all support each other in so we can elevate. We can elevate. Each each other in relationship like Gary and Rob in our in our personal lives and our professional lives and that can be extended out to elevating asking ourselves questions of how can I even refine this more. How can I support people more deeply. How can i.

48:10.84
wildremedies
He.

48:26.84
Robert _ Gary
What is it that I'm called to create that's going to support more people in an elevated refined way and just asking those questions of like even what does my community need from me. What does my community want from me so that there is. That elevation. There is that raising up of of soul community which is one of our 1 of our taglines on Youtube. Yeah.

48:48.58
wildremedies
Me.

48:59.53
wildremedies
Um, union.

49:01.67
wildremedies
Yeah, yeah, and like an I envision like especially I mean for British Columbia I would say and the okinagan in particular like we have.

49:11.81
Robert _ Gary
1 yeah.

49:17.19
wildremedies
The most wonderful talented healers flooding to this area right now right? So I think it's just such an amazing opportunity for everyone to just start working together and connecting and learning from each other and you know that's my.. That's my hope. That's my dream. That's what I love I Love connecting people I Love all the amazing people in our community and getting everyone together to learn from each other and create and build just you know a more beautiful world that revolves around healing I think that's what.

49:47.96
Robert _ Gary
I know.

49:49.88
wildremedies
This whole generation is about is just transmuting and healing generations of like so much darkness and will hopefully allow us to get to a place where we can continue to thrive on this planet.

49:57.13
Robert _ Gary
Um, absolutely absolutely yeah moved.

50:07.83
wildremedies
Yay! Well thank you guys so much for your perspective and for being such great leaders in this space. Really appreciate that. Yeah.

50:10.25
Robert _ Gary
He was welcome was such a pleasure. Ask us to come back on a second time round. Yeah.

50:22.23
wildremedies
And yeah, yeah, it's a great topic and maybe we'll have a round three next time something else comes up. Yeah, maybe we? yeah well and once you guys Actually you know.

50:24.50
Robert _ Gary
It's forever exactly soulful collaborations galore.

50:40.44
wildremedies
Dart This new program in particular. Maybe we can chat about that because I'm sure there's lots of people listening and in our in our community that would be interested maybe mentoring and and learning from you guys and you know it's It's really potent amazing work and um, yeah.

50:44.70
Robert _ Gary
Um, man.

50:58.59
wildremedies
Be really cool to go to mystery school with you guys.

50:58.68
Robert _ Gary
Um, be school brilliant. Yeah.

51:06.40
wildremedies
Um, yay. Okay, well if anybody wants to learn more about either journeying with you guys or just maybe being able to get in touch to learn about things that you're going to offer in the future. What's the best way for them to do that.

51:10.39
Robert _ Gary
Yeah, through our website wwdotthejourneymancollective.com and we're on Instagram saying handle and Facebook also and some on Youtube. Yeah, thank you.

51:26.16
wildremedies
Um, is.

51:29.50
Robert _ Gary
Thank you.

51:30.58
wildremedies
Amazing. Okay, thank you guys so much for anybody listening who enjoyed this episode who wants to share it with someone please do always give us feedback would love that and we'll catch you all on the next episode.